Subjects: CPRS, Christmas Island, Premier Mike Rann, Disability Insurance Scheme
GILBERT: Welcome back to AM Agenda with me now our panel, Liberal MP Jamie Briggs and Labor Parliamentary Secretary Richard Marles, gentlemen good morning to you both.
MARLES: Morning Kieran.
BRIGGS: Morning Kieran.
GILBERT: We discussed the timeline with Tony Burke a little earlier, doesn’t give you much time Jamie for the coalition to come up with what you’re going to do on this, do you feel like you’re being ambushed?
BRIGGS: The process is the process, we will get as I understand, the offer between the Government, the conclusions of the negotiations between Penny Wong and Ian McFarlane tomorrow morning. We will have our normal party room tomorrow morning, we will have our normal discussion in the party room and the party room will make a decision and we’ll proceed from there.
GILBERT: What’s your sense? Do you think Malcolm Turnbull will get the compromise and this all will get through?
BRIGGS: Well what we’ve said is that the current Bill is bad, it’s terrible for Australia and we won’t support the current Bill and we voted against the current Bill in the House of Representatives last week, as we did in August earlier this year. We’ve set a series of amendments which Ian McFarlane has been negotiating with Penny Wong, we’ve seen some movement on agriculture which is important, we don’t know the outcome of the other areas, we have to wait and see to see what the Government is willing to do, we’re going to stand up for Australian jobs, we’re going to stand up for Australian small businesses, we’re not going to apologise for that, we’re going to stand up for Australian farmers. The Government wants to introduce a piece of legislation which will damage those sectors of our economy, we won’t allow that to occur so that’s what we’re standing up for, we’ll wait and see what the outcome of that is.
GILBERT: Given the Government is making some significant concessions here, doesn’t it show that it was flawed from the outset, isn’t it a concession?
MARLES: No I think the CPRS has been a piece of legislation which I think is very well balanced that’s trying to deal with probably the most difficult public policy challenge that this country has ever faced, putting a price on carbon within our economy, we’ve done that in a way which has been done in a balanced way which addresses the fact that if we do not act on climate change then that is going to be the most expensive option for Australian business and for our country and that in acting now there is a cost of course but we’re trying to share that evenly throughout the economy. But can I just also say this Kieran, from the outset, from the very outset it has always been the best outcome I think, that there be an agreement between the major political parties in this country around this great public policy challenge so that there is a consensus position, and so we’ve been trying to negotiate with the Liberal Party for a long time now and it’s why it’s so important that they rise above the divisions that they are facing at the moment and that we get a vote on this issue this week.
GILBERT: Do you think Kevin Rudd will cop some flack politically if he doesn’t get it through? This was a key plank of the last election campaign, dealing with climate change, you can’t just sit idle if this isn’t secured through the Senate can you?
MARLES: Ultimately what you’ve just said in a sense is a challenge for the Opposition, I mean what we want to do and what we’ve always wanted to do is get in place a piece of legislation around climate change which puts a price on carbon within our economy, we’ve been doing everything within our power to do that and our hope is very much that we get this through the Parliament this week, it’s why what we need right now is a commitment from the Leader of the Opposition that there will be a vote on the CPRS this week.
GILBERT: Jamie Briggs if Malcolm Turnbull doesn’t get this compromise through, if a large section of the party crosses the floor how damaging will that be? Is his leadership over?
BRIGGS: No, Malcolm Turnbull’s leadership is very solid; this is an issue which people have very strong views on. I’m not going to get into hypotheticals about what may or may not happen, we’re waiting for the Labor Party to make an offer on the amendments we’ve suggested, we’ve been very positive and proactive in this process, we’ve been bargaining in good faith, something I know Richard supports in other areas.
GILBERT: Some of you have, but then you’ve got Minchin, Abbott, and others. What are they playing at?
BRIGGS: Well they’re just expressing their view on the Bill, they’re entitled to do so, in the Liberal Party we do have a debate, the Labor Party, run like some sort of North Korean communist organisation is told what to do and how to say it and so forth but we have different views, it’s important for Australian public policy, you know it’s not illegal to question one aspect of an approach on climate change, it’s not illegal to do that and I think it’s important that we have a full ranging debate. We know for instance that in the Labor Party there is significant concerns that those who represent working people in some seats they have with this Bill, we know when Martin Ferguson for instance stands up that he’s not what you would call completely over the top in his excitement for the Bill that’s before the Parliament.
GILBERT: Are there some in your party that are concerned that Ian McFarlane is a victim of the Stockholm Syndrome here as some people have been suggesting, that he’s just got too close to Penny Wong in all of this.
BRIGGS: Well I think there’s always a danger in Canberra that people become victims of the Canberra syndrome and get a little obsessed by the process. I think what’s happening here is we’re waiting in good faith for the Government to offer what are the deal on the amendments, we’ve suggested we’re very clear on those amendments, we’ll stand up for Australian workers, we’ll stand up for Australian small business, we’re standing up for Australian farmers. We’ll see what the Government is willing to offer, if they’re serious, the ball is in their court, they can get this bill through if they’re serious this week.
GILBERT: Okay, Richard?
MARLES: Well I think when you hear the North Korean analogy with the Labor Party you know the Libs don’t want anyone focusing upon them, the real issue here is that there is a problem within the Liberal Party, they are horribly divided on this issue, we are trying to negotiate in good faith with them to get the outcome that our country needs, to get a bipartisan, consensus outcome across the great parties of our country, but the problem is that there’s a fair swag of the Liberal Party which simply don’t want to be at the table, they do not want to do the dance on this issue at any cost at all, and that’s why the whole process has been stalled from day one, and that’s why it’s so important that Malcolm Turnbull demonstrates some leadership today and say that there will be a vote on the CPRS this week.
GILBERT: But would it really be that disastrous if there wasn’t because there’s been no momentum internationally, as you heard from Tony Burke suggest before that there’s talk of a high level political agreement but no substantive treaty or binding targets.
MARLES: I think it would be a very adverse outcome for our nation if we do not put this through the Parliament this week, we’ve been dealing with this issue for twelve years, twelve long years with no action at all. We have done everything we can to bring this to a head so that we actually get a vote on climate change, we’ve got a great proposal in front of the Parliament, for the Australian people which is balanced, which tackles this difficult issue, and I think for it not to occur this week would be a terrible statement indeed for the future of the country in terms of putting a price on carbon within our economy, the thing we need to do…
GILBERT: This issue is obviously going to dominate the Parliamentary sitting this final week of the year but a few other issues I want to touch on before we wrap up the program. A riot at the Christmas Island Detention Centre Jamie, thirty-seven treated at the centre, ten at the hospital nearby, what’s your reaction to that?
BRIGGS: Well my reaction is that today we need actually see Kevin Rudd in Parliament open up and be honest with the Australian people about what is happening with his fiasco of a border protection policy, we’ve seen for the last five weeks the sort of Indian Ocean cruise with the Oceanic Viking, that’s come to an end with some sort of special deal, the Prime Minister has not been honest with the Parliament about that. Today we need to see some honesty in relation to this issue as well, what actually happened, lay it out in front of the Parliament so we can see what’s going on with this fiasco of a border protection policy.
GILBERT: It doesn’t say much for security at the centre Richard if a hundred and fifty people have been involved in this riot, apparently went on for quite a while.
MARLES: Well I think it went on for thirty minutes, I think the disturbance was brought under control within that period of time, there were a number of people who were injured and they’ve been dealt with but these kinds of disturbances happen in detention centres around the world. By definition you’re talking about people who have fled a miserable existence somewhere else in the world and who are in a stressed situation, it’s being handled, it’s being handled in an appropriate way, there are officials from the Department of Immigration, they’re dealing with it as there are officers of the Australian Federal Police and I think it’s being handled well.
GILBERT: But security, I mean, for it to go on for thirty minutes, one hundred and fifty people involved, it sounds like quite a clash.
MARLES: Well look, it has been a disturbance of that magnitude, but it was brought under control within thirty minutes, it’s being dealt with, but I think the thing to remember is this kind of stuff happens in places like this around the world. I don’t think it’s quite the big deal that the Liberal Party want to make of it and it is being handled soberly and appropriately.
GILBERT: Jamie on another matter you’re from South Australia of course, we’ve seen the reports about the Premier, should we all take a deep breath and wait for him to provide his explanation before making any claims.
BRIGGS: We’ll see, today, I presume Mike Rann respond to the allegations which were aired last night, there was it appears, some inconsistencies between what he’s previously said and what were aired last night. I think on the overall generic issue about politicians’ private lives, I think the answer to whether they should be public or not, or these issue should be discussed that no, politicians’ private lives are generally off-bounds unless there is an issue which raises a public interest test and does it affect the job of the relevant politician.
GILBERT: And what’s your view on this one at the moment, do you think that it does?
BRIGGS: Well I think we need to see what Mike Rann’s response is today, I think it’s very important for Mike Rann to address what appears to be the inconsistencies, it’s very much up for Mike Rann to explain those inconsistencies and to prove that his version of events, but then really it’s a matter for the Labor Party to decide how they proceed as far as his leadership is concerned.
GILBERT: The Prime Minister made some comments about this yesterday, he was asked about it, let’s recap a bit of what he had to say.
PM RUDD: These are personal matters and my experience of Mike Rann over many many years is that he is a first-class Premier and I know of nobody who sticks up for his state more than Mike Rann. This is a bloke who goes out there and argues the case for South Australia day-in, day-out, never off the telephone to me, wanting something better for his state.
GILBERT: Richard, an emphatic endorsement of Mike Rann as Premier from the Prime Minister, what have you made of this story, Jamie’s expressed one view on it, it’s obviously difficult and we know the tradition in Australia is not to report on private lives of politicians, what have you made of this?
MARLES: Well I think the right response was in your question, we should be waiting to hear what Mike Rann has to say about this later today, I would absolutely agree with the Prime Minister that Mike Rann is a fantastic Premier, he’s one of the very best Premiers in Australia, I’ve known Mike for a long time indeed, I was in South Australia a few weeks ago for the opening of the Royal Institution of Australia which is very much one of Mike’s projects, he’s doing incredible things with that state and I don’t see that any of this really has much impact or anything to do with his running of South Australia.
GILBERT: Because it is always that blurred line in terms of reporting on private lives, what’s your view on that more broadly?
MARLES: I think that we should be making judgements on those things which are relevant to the way in which people do their jobs, I think personal relationships are the hardest things that any of us do in our lives, but they’re not relevant in terms of how we do our job and how in this case a state is governed and I think it’s just important that people judge Mike Rann on the issues which he is elected to deal with and that’s running the state.
GILBERT: Okay, one last issue I want to touch on, there’s speculation the Prime Minister is going to announce a National Disability Insurance Scheme, wide ranging scheme like Medicare to provide Government support on an official basis to carers and people with disabilities. Good idea?
MARLES: Well look I don’t want to pre-empt any statements that are made by the Government in this area, it was an idea that came out of the 2020 summit and like many of the ideas it’s one which is under active consideration from the Government. I think people who have disabilities deal with challenges that most of us could not imagine. Putting in place such an insurance scheme obviously would be a very complex task and I’ll leave statements on that to the Minister.
GILBERT: An enormous task for anyone obviously with disabilities, importantly as well for carers and I remember the Prime Minister at a Community Cabinet in Penrith, a woman stood up and gave him three or four minutes on exactly what she’s been though for thirty years, an adult son; she’s been caring for him throughout his entire life, enormous challenges, what do you think of this idea? Do you think it’s a good proposal?
BRIGGS: We haven’t seen any detail yet, we’ve just heard it floated, the issue I think that does need to be addressed is the significant concern in South Australia particularly, we’ve seen recently some terrible examples of the reaction in my home town of Mount Barker, there was a terrible incident recently with a carer of a severely disabled child and I think we do need to do that better but let’s wait and see what the Government announces, we see these sort of previews from time to time and not much follows so lets wait and see.
GILBERT: All right gentlemen, as always it’s great to see you both, it should be a fascinating week, final week of the year, we’ll no doubt speak with you before Christmas though but thank you for today.
MARLES: Thanks Kieran.
BRIGGS: Thanks Kieran.
GILBERT: … Jamie Briggs, Richard Marles. David Spears will be along 4:15 Eastern Daylight Saving Time for PM Agenda, I’m Kieran Gilbert thanks for your company.
END